Welcome to the NavList Message Boards.

NavList:

A Community Devoted to the Preservation and Practice of Celestial Navigation and Other Methods of Traditional Wayfinding

Compose Your Message

Message:αβγ
Message:abc
Add Images & Files
    Name or NavList Code:
    Email:
       
    Reply
    Re: Sun alignment for Veterans Day
    From: Don Seltzer
    Date: 2015 Nov 11, 15:22 -0500
    Chief engineer Jim Martin had this to say,
    "The answer really relates to the celestial motion of the sun along with time corrections that were internationally adopted in 1972 when International Atomic Time became the world standard for measuring time. International Atomic Time implements leap second corrections to the clock to compensate for pole wandering, slowing of the earth’s rotation and the UT1 correction for seasonal variations. This is the time that we see on our computers and cellphones; it automatically adjusts and is really not observable without very accurate timepiece comparisons.

    With that said, the variation of the sun’s position on any day and time is extremely close – even on a leap year. The leap calendar, along with the other corrections to the Atomic Clock, was a brilliant astronomical feat to allow the ephemeral location of the sun to be so precise relative to time.

    When planning the geometry of the Anthem Veterans Memorial, it was clear that the static nature of the structure would require a fixed azimuth (the horizontal angle from astronomical north to the center of the sun on Nov. 11 at 11:11 a.m. that creates the horizontal illumination of the Great Seal) and a fixed altitude angle (the vertical angle for zenith, or horizon, to the center of the sun on Nov. 11 at 11:11 a.m. that creates the vertical illumination of the Great Seal).

    Each year, the center of the sun is slightly offset from other years by just a few horizontal or vertical arc-seconds relative to the timing of the required azimuth/altitude position of the sun. This does create a time correction that is very minor; it cannot be perfectly aligned at precisely aligned at 11:11:11 a.m. every year due to the static alignment of the memorial. To deal with this adjustment, we calculated the perfect solar position every year from 2011 to 2111 and at what time (International Atomic Time plus corrections) perfect illumination would occur. The time variance over 100 years was calculated to be a cyclical range of perfect illumination sometime between 11:10:58 AM and 11:11:22 AM, a difference of 24 time seconds.

    Using the statistical mean of the 100-year data, the altitude and azimuth angles for the structure were adjusted to provide time/error fluctuation of plus or minus 12 time seconds from the International Atomic Time mark of 11:11:11 a.m. That small time difference allows for additional compensation of the variations that you mention. We also checked the variance 500 years out, and if the structure is still standing, it will work.

    In complete truth, it is not perfect; the only way to do that would be to move the ellipses very slightly each year which is really not a recommended option. I would say that it is perfect if you recognize the plus or minus 12 time second difference for 11:11:11 a.m."


    Don Seltzer



    On Wed, Nov 11, 2015 at 1:36 PM, Frank Reed <NoReply_FrankReed@fer3.com> wrote:

    Veterans Day in the US and Rememberance Day in Commonwealth countries are celebrated on November 11 which was originally known as, and still is known in many countries as Armistice Day, the anniversary of the armistice that ended the Great War or First World War (at least those portions of the war in western Europe). The armistice came into effect and the "guns fell silent" on the Western Front famously at 11:00 am Paris time, and thus it was the "eleventh hour of the eleventh day of the eleventh month". Many memorials add another "11" to this and mark the time of 11:11 as the instant to be noticed. 

    In Anthem, Arizona there is a veterans memorial that acts as a once-a-year sundial of sorts. At 11:11 am "Mountain Time" (about a minute ago, as I write this --see PS) the memorial shines a circle of light through five pillars. See the article here for photos:
    http://twistedsifter.com/2014/11/anthem-arizona-veterans-memorial/

    For celestial navigation enthusiasts, some things to consider: how does it look the day before? Or the day after? A minute before or after 11:11? And is it affected by the leap year cycle? Did the designers have to correct for refraction? Can you think of any other issues?

    Frank Reed
    PS: As I was composing this, I wanted to make sure that the memorial worked with Mountain Standard Time, so I went to Google and typed in "Arizona Time". Google then displayed "11:11". I was puzzled and thought it was trying too hard to read my mind. Then I realized that, just by chance, I was asking for Arizona time at the exact minute when the sundial does its trick: the eleventh minute of the eleventh hour of the eleventh day of the eleventh month, at least in Arizona. A coincidence!



    Attached File:

    (anthem-v-day-sundial.jpg: Open and save)


       
    Reply
    Browse Files

    Drop Files

    NavList

    What is NavList?

    Get a NavList ID Code

    Name:
    (please, no nicknames or handles)
    Email:
    Do you want to receive all group messages by email?
    Yes No

    A NavList ID Code guarantees your identity in NavList posts and allows faster posting of messages.

    Retrieve a NavList ID Code

    Enter the email address associated with your NavList messages. Your NavList code will be emailed to you immediately.
    Email:

    Email Settings

    NavList ID Code:

    Custom Index

    Subject:
    Author:
    Start date: (yyyymm dd)
    End date: (yyyymm dd)

    Visit this site
    Visit this site
    Visit this site
    Visit this site
    Visit this site
    Visit this site