Welcome to the NavList Message Boards.

NavList:

A Community Devoted to the Preservation and Practice of Celestial Navigation and Other Methods of Traditional Wayfinding

Compose Your Message

Message:αβγ
Message:abc
Add Images & Files
    Name or NavList Code:
    Email:
       
    Reply
    Re: News Item on Over-reliance on GPS
    From: Lu Abel
    Date: 2008 Nov 03, 11:03 -0800
    Thanks, Richard!

    What's still not clear from the report is whether use of GPS in any way resulted in the boat's running aground.  On-shore gale force winds certainly seem like darn sloppy conditions for a 25' sailboat!   What the MCA report says is that "the yacht's GPS had failed and the crew could only make a rough estimate of their position [for rescuers]"

    It sounds like these folks had less than total situational awareness (eg, didn't know exactly where they had grounded), but that could easily be due to conditions other than the use of GPS -- for example, how many of us could keep a DR plot under the snotty conditions that beset this boat?   And the boat did run aground in daylight, so they ought to have seen how near they were getting to the shore.

    Again, I'm not excusing poor navigation practices if that's indeed what happened.   But I also have a lot of trouble with the tendency of "experts" to assign "GPS problems" as the reason for any on-the-water incident where the boat was carrying and using a GPS.   Some on this list are pilots and I understand pilots get very angry when a crash is dismissed as "pilot error" even before an investigation is completed; I see an analogy.

    Lu

    Richard B. Langley wrote:
    A little bit more information from the Coast Guard:
    <http://nds.coi.gov.uk/Content/Detail.asp?ReleaseID=382944&NewsAreaID=2>
    -- Richard
    
    Quoting Lu Abel <lunav@abelhome.net>:
    
      
    It would be nice to have a little more detail on exactly what occurred
    other than "the GPS failed"   When did the GPS fail, was the skipper
    aware of the problem, and what navigation techniques were employed after
    the GPS failed?
    
    Any skipper who just follows the his GPS blindly without situational
    awareness is dumb, dumb, dumb.   But I don't blame the GPS for that, but
    over-reliance on it by humans.
    
    That's probably the dilemma:   with traditional techniques like
    celestial, bearings, and DR plots, the navigator had a high degree of
    situational awareness.   Using a chart for all this navigation work was
    unavoidable, giving awareness of what was around and beneath and ahead
    of the boat.   With GPS, sadly, the box just produces magic numbers (or
    magic "steer in this direction" commands).   I teach coastal piloting
    frequently, I do admit that GPS exists and is a useful tool, I spend
    time on how to get the most out of it, but then I also spend even more
    time on how to keep out of trouble when using it, and what to do when
    the screen goes blank.
    
    Lu
    
    Richard B. Langley wrote:
        
    <http://news.bbc.co.uk/2/hi/uk_news/england/essex/7704769.stm>
    
    ===============================================================================
     Richard B. Langley                            E-mail: lang@unb.ca
     Geodetic Research Laboratory                  Web: http://www.unb.ca/GGE/
     Dept. of Geodesy and Geomatics Engineering    Phone:    +1 506 453-5142
     University of New Brunswick                   Fax:      +1 506 453-4943
     Fredericton, N.B., Canada  E3B 5A3
         Fredericton?  Where's that?  See: http://www.city.fredericton.nb.ca/
    ===============================================================================
    
    
    
          
          
    
    
    ===============================================================================
     Richard B. Langley                            E-mail: lang@unb.ca
     Geodetic Research Laboratory                  Web: http://www.unb.ca/GGE/
     Dept. of Geodesy and Geomatics Engineering    Phone:    +1 506 453-5142
     University of New Brunswick                   Fax:      +1 506 453-4943
     Fredericton, N.B., Canada  E3B 5A3
         Fredericton?  Where's that?  See: http://www.city.fredericton.nb.ca/
    ===============================================================================
    
    
    
    
      

    --~--~---------~--~----~------------~-------~--~----~
    Navigation List archive: www.fer3.com/arc
    To post, email NavList@fer3.com
    To , email NavList-@fer3.com
    -~----------~----~----~----~------~----~------~--~---

       
    Reply
    Browse Files

    Drop Files

    NavList

    What is NavList?

    Get a NavList ID Code

    Name:
    (please, no nicknames or handles)
    Email:
    Do you want to receive all group messages by email?
    Yes No

    A NavList ID Code guarantees your identity in NavList posts and allows faster posting of messages.

    Retrieve a NavList ID Code

    Enter the email address associated with your NavList messages. Your NavList code will be emailed to you immediately.
    Email:

    Email Settings

    NavList ID Code:

    Custom Index

    Subject:
    Author:
    Start date: (yyyymm dd)
    End date: (yyyymm dd)

    Visit this site
    Visit this site
    Visit this site
    Visit this site
    Visit this site
    Visit this site