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    Re: LORAN-C to be shut down.
    From: Lu Abel
    Date: 2009 Dec 06, 17:01 -0800
    Guess I need my eyes checked -- what I see when I bring up the link you posted is a tabular listing of LA AM radio stations.   The tabulation contains the following:  Call letters, frequency, a column that indicates day/night/both, a couple of unlabeled single-character alphabetic columns, a column that says "LIC," city, state, country, a wide unlabled column filled with things like "BL---" (license number?), transmitter power, link to detailed records for station, and name of licensee.   That's it.   No lat/long...

    glapook---.net wrote:
    But the link I posted gives the location of all the antennas of AM
    stations in Los Angeles on one page, look again.
    
    gl
    
    On Dec 6, 8:12 am, Lu Abel <lu...{at}abelhome.net> wrote:
      
    Before I wrote my previous email I did get as far as finding a listing
    such as this.   But this one merely gives a list of stations in a
    particular area.   To get the lat/long of their antennas, one would have
    to click on each entry (and then another click or two) to get the
    lat/long for one particular station.   One would then have to manually
    copy that information into a separate document to make a list of the
    lat/longs of all stations in a particular area.
    
    Perhaps I misunderstood, but I thought your earlier post claimed one
    could get a lat/long /list /directly from the FCC site.
    
    Lu
    
    Gary LaPook wrote:
        
    Here is an example, all the Los Angeles AM stations
          
    http://www.fcc.gov/fcc-bin/amq?state=CA&call=&arn=&city=los+angeles&f...
          
    gl
          
    Lu Abel wrote:
          
    Do you have a URL for this list of lat/long for US stations?   I've
    searched the FCC site and the only thing I can find is something
    where you have to identify each individual station and after a few
    clicks you can get its antenna location.   And then it's in NAD27
    coordinates!
            
    Thanks
            
    Apache Runner wrote:
            
    Although this is a completely out-of-the-box idea, I've been working
    on an AM radio receiver/direction finder for fun.    The FCC
    publishes the lat/long for all stations in the US.  
              
    I haven't seen a variable capacitor in ages, but managed to find
    some beauties online, and am making my own antenna.    Right now, I
    think I can get an accuracy of maybe 3 degrees, but that's just a
    guess.  
              
    I'll post something when I have it up and running.
              
    On Sat, Dec 5, 2009 at 3:03 AM, glap...---.net
    <mailto:glap...---.net> <glap...---.net
    <mailto:glap...---.net>> wrote:
              
        I know we have some commercial air pilots on the list and was
        wondering if
        they thought an aircraft RDF unit could be easily mounted on a boat.
        The
        aircraft industry seems to be the only ones making small units these
        days.
        I might go ocean cruising with a friend who is presently re-fitting
        his
        boat, and I am a big fan of redundancy, and thought this might be a
        workable
        solution.
              
        ---------------------------------------------------------------------------
              
        An ADF will work on a boat but they aren't cheap, the readout is
        only
        marked every 5 degrees and the antenna has to be mounted
        somewhere. If
        you want RDF capability just by an inexpensive digitally tuned
        portable radio that covers the LF band such as the Grundig G5 which
        also covers HF and has SSB capability so you can get your time
        signals  too. These all have ferrite rod internal antennas which are
        highly directional. Get one and tune a distant station. Then orient
        the radio in different attitudes and rotate the radio until you
        get a
        null which will let you know the orientation of the ferrite rod.
        Then
        you can use the edge of the radio to indicate the direction to the
        station. Place it on top of a universal plotting sheet to use as a
        compass rose placed on a table or nav station desk and rotate the
        radio to get a null. You may want to make a calibration table
        for it.
        Don't worry about the lack of a sense antenna which are really only
        needed by an ADF since a human can easily determine which is the
        correct bearing, the 180 degree ambiguity, which is a big
        problem for
        an ADF, is not a problem for a human.
              
        gl
              
        On Dec 4, 11:48 am, Bruce Hamilton <brucerhamil...---.com
        <mailto:brucerhamil...---.com>> wrote:
        > If GPS goes dark, Jeremy will be in a great position to
        negotiate a salary
        > raise.
              
        >  I had great hope for e-loran as going to a single system with
        no redundancy
        > seems risky at best. Even when Loran C coverage was poor, even the
        > information from a single chain would give you something to
        work with. In
        > the middle of Lake Superior, coverage was always spotty, and
        on the East
        > Coast of Canada we would often be on a single chain only 50
        miles off the
        > coast.
              
        > Jeremy, do you still have a working RDF?  I used them on
        aircraft all the
        > time, but must admit the one on the first ship I was on was
        not often used
        > and this was pre-gps. I have a working portable (Ray
        Jefferson) RDF that I
        > am going to try in a friend's boat. It is a pity that the
        technology got
        > left behind in the GPS age as the modern RDF's are apparently
        very good and
        > very quick. The signal from the multiple antennas is instantly
        processed and
        > you get an bearing read out.  The Canadian Coast Guard use
        them to get
        > instant fixes from distress signals in pre-GMDSS days. They
        have remote
        > stations they use to get a cross bearings from. No GPS required.
              
        > I know we have some commercial air pilots on the list and was
        wondering if
        > they thought an aircraft RDF unit could be easily mounted on a
        boat. The
        > aircraft industry seems to be the only ones making small units
        these days.
        > I might go ocean cruising with a friend who is presently
        re-fitting his
        > boat, and I am a big fan of redundancy, and thought this might
        be a workable
        > solution.
              
        > A fine page of old RDF units
        <http://www.angelfire.com/space/proto57/rdf.html>
              
        > On Fri, Dec 4, 2009 at 8:09 AM, <Anabasi...---.com
        <mailto:Anabasi...---.com>> wrote:
        > >  I read the following on a maritime forum site.  Looks like
        LORAN-C
        > > systems run by the US will be shut down sooner than we thought.
        > > -----------------------------
        > > The US Coast Guard released an internal message advising of
        the imminent
        > > termination of the long range aid to navigation Loran-C.
        Current plans call
        > > for the termination process to commence on 4 January 2010.
        The process is
        > > expected to take several months. ALCOAST
        675/09<http://www.uscg.mil/announcements/alcoast/675-09_alcoast.txt>(11/25/09).
        > > *Note: This will mark the end of an era that started during
        World War II.
        > > The Loran system has improved greatly over the years and was
        on the edge of
        > > yet another advance: to enhanced Loran (eLoran). It is
        unclear how other
        > > nations, which operate their own independent Loran-C
        systems, will react to
        > > this development. *
        > > Courtesy: Bryant�s Maritime Blog � 1 December
        2009<http://bryantsmaritimeblog.blogspot.com/2009/12/bryants-maritime-blog...>
        > > ------------------------------
              
        > > Not that this will affect many large ships.  My ship hasn't
        had LORAN
        > > capabilities since the antenna broke 3 years ago and the
        captain was too
        > > afraid to order a new antenna.  Most merchant ships are
        utterly dependent on
        > > GPS at this point, and would have a tough time remembering
        how to use the
        > > sextant if it came down to that point.  It will only get
        worse when the
        > > younger generations take command, having never known a time
        without GPS.
              
        > > JCA
              
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